Was OT originally in Greek?

Discussion about the Hebrew Bible, Septuagint, pseudepigrapha, Philo, Josephus, Talmud, Dead Sea Scrolls, archaeology, etc.
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Ben C. Smith
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Re: Was OT originally in Greek?

Post by Ben C. Smith » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:00 pm

Ethan wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:51 pm
The Arabic prefix article ال (el-) is phonetically close to the Hebrew , אל
and with the Latin, Ille e.g. Magnus Ille Alexander ( Alexander the Great).
Deliberately ignoring this. I have already been roped into more silliness than I care to indulge in.
Gen 31:48 "This Hill"
ה זה (E GL)
ὁ βουνὸς (Septuagint)
ὁ κολωνός (dialectic translation)
la colina (Spanish)
collis (Latin )

What Latin word would go before "Collis" that equates with ὁ ?
Classical Latin would have nothing before collis (the Vulgate has tumulus), since classical Latin lacks definite articles. But medieval Latin would probably have ille. (But you already knew this. Why are you stalling?)
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Ethan
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Re: Was OT originally in Greek?

Post by Ethan » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:01 pm

I always find interesting verses.

Deuteronomy 29:3 "The great temptations"

ה מסות ה גדלת
τοὺς πειρασμοὺς τοὺς μεγάλους

Latin : Temptationes magnas

Why does Greek & Hebrew repeat the article?
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Re: Was OT originally in Greek?

Post by Ben C. Smith » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:20 pm

Ethan wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:01 pm
I always find interesting verses.

Deuteronomy 29:3 "The great temptations"

ה מסות ה גדלת
τοὺς πειρασμοὺς τοὺς μεγάλους

Latin : Temptationes magnas

Why does Greek & Hebrew repeat the article?
If you are not even aware that an adjective in attributive position can/must take its own definite article, both in Greek and in Hebrew, how are you even remotely qualified to speak to the derivation of grammatical structures in one language from those of another? The attributive position of the adjective is first-year stuff.
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Re: Was OT originally in Greek?

Post by Ethan » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:37 pm

Ben C. Smith wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:20 pm

If you are not even aware that an adjective in attributive position can/must take its own definite article, both in Greek and in Hebrew, how are you even remotely qualified to speak to the derivation of grammatical structures in one language from those of another? The attributive position of the adjective is first-year stuff.
Then Biblical Aramaic and Hebrew are demonstrably Greek in grammar and vocabulary.
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Re: Was OT originally in Greek?

Post by Ben C. Smith » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:50 pm

Ethan wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:37 pm
Ben C. Smith wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:20 pm

If you are not even aware that an adjective in attributive position can/must take its own definite article, both in Greek and in Hebrew, how are you even remotely qualified to speak to the derivation of grammatical structures in one language from those of another? The attributive position of the adjective is first-year stuff.
Then Biblical Aramaic and Hebrew are demonstrably Greek in grammar and vocabulary.
Nonsense. Ten minutes ago you did not even know what the attributive position was. Tell me how the attributive position of an adjective is expressed in German, in French, in Swedish, in Yiddish, in Arabic, in Swahili, in Hindi, in Japanese, or in Thai. Which of these structures are similar and which ones are different? How common or uncommon is it for a parent language to express the attributive position in the English manner but its daughter language(s) to express it in the Hebrew manner, or vice versa?
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Re: Was OT originally in Greek?

Post by Ethan » Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:00 pm

The Wise Man
ὁ σοφὸς ἀνήρ - החכם איש (emphasis is on the attributive)
ὁ ἀνὴρ ὁ σοφός - האיש החכם ( emphasis is on the noun)
ἀνὴρ ὁ σοφός - איש החכם (attributive is added by way of explanation)
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Re: Was OT originally in Greek?

Post by lpetrich » Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:26 pm

Ethan wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:16 pm
The Phoenician cultures that dominated the coastlines of Ancient Spain, who founded the first cities in Europe, just a Cadiz, they
never existed and had zero influence on Spanish language and cultures and the entire culture of Spain is pedigree Latin? (inlined image snipped for brevity)
An argument that seems to me like "Waah! I can't believe that there is no Santa Claus!"

I looked for a list of Spanish words of Phoenician origin, and I could not find any such list. There is one word in the language that may have a Phoenician origin: the name of the language itself. It is derived from Hispania, the Romans' name of the peninsula where it emerged from Latin. Hispania - Wikipedia notes several theories on that name's origin, including a theory that it is derived from a Phoenician word for rabbit. Thus making the territory Rabbit Land.

Place names often have great longevity, so some cities and rivers and territories in Spain may have Phoenician names. Some have Roman names, like Valencia (Valentia) and Zaragoza (Caesar Augusta), so some may have even older names.

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Re: Was OT originally in Greek?

Post by Ethan » Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:27 pm

σοφὸς : חכם
- שיח/ψυχ/הגה/ἦχος/ἅγιος/εὐήχων /μουσικός/שקמ/Συκάμινο/משיח

A word of many cognates.
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Re: Was OT originally in Greek?

Post by Ethan » Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:40 pm

Familian : עמילאמ - Ϝὁμιλίαν ( Family)
música : משיח - μουσικός (Music)
agua : אפיק - πηγή (Water)
hielo : שלג/תלג - χάλαζα (Ice/Snow)
Salud : שלות (Welfare)
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Re: Was OT originally in Greek?

Post by Ethan » Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:59 pm

Luna: לבנה "Moon" (Sng 6:10)
Cueva : כף "Cave/Hollow of a Rock" (Job 30:6)
Capital : כפתר "off a Pillar/plant" ( Exo 25:34)
Medida מדד "measure" ( Num 35:5)

Why is it so easy to find Hebrew-Spanish cognates?

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/medida
https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/le ... ongs=H4058
https://vivliothikiagiasmatos.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/joseph-yahuda-hebrew-is-greek.pdf
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