On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Discussion about the New Testament, apocrypha, gnostics, church fathers, Christian origins, historical Jesus or otherwise, etc.
Secret Alias
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On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Post by Secret Alias »

Another point that Carlson (and later Evans) make is that it is surprising to find Voss's 1646 edition of Ignatius at the Mar Saba monastery because most of the foreign books were published in Venice. Carlson says that the Amsterdam book 'stands out like a sore thumb.' However it is worth noting that there is a possible path way for a Dutch book to have made its way to the Jerusalem Patriarchate.
After the learned Cyrillus Lascaris, patriarch of Constantinople, had atoned, with his life, for the approach to Protestantism perceptible in his creed, A. D. 1629, an exposition of the doctrine of the Russians was drawn up, in the Greek language, by Pet Mogislaus, bishop of Kiev, 1642, under the title the Orthodox Confession of the Catholic and Apostolic Church of Christ, signed and ratified, 1643, by all die patriarchs of the Greek church, to whom had been added, in 1589, the fifth patriarch of Moscow. It was printed in Holland, in Greek and Latin, 1662, with a preface by the patriarch Nectarius of Jerusalem. In 1696, it was published by the last Russian patriarch, Adrianus of Moscow; and, in 1722, at the command of Peter the Great, by the holy synod; it having been previously declared to be in all cases valid, as the ritual of the Greek church, by a council at Jerusalem, in 1672, and by the ecclesiastical rule of Peter the Great, drawn up, in 1721, by Theophanes Procowicz.
Also:
The first edition of the Orthodox Confession was that of Panagiotti , published in 1662 at Amsterdam with a Preface by Nectarius , and erroneously said by Nectarius himself to be “ in the Hellenic and the Latin languages . ” The Latin translation as Arnaud says , was sent together with his own Greek MS . by Panagiotti as a present to Louis XIV .; and both are still preserved in the Royal Library at Paris . The same writer Arnaud quotes a letter from M. Olivier de Nointel , French Ambassador at the Porte in 1670 , from whence it appears that the States of Holland made Panagiotti a present of the expense of printing his edition . Hoffman mentions a second edition, also brought out in Holland, in 1672, by order of Dionysius, Patriarch of Constantinople; but Albert Fabricius and Francis Buddeus do not mention it. ... If it be asked how much weight is to be attached to the Orthodox Confession, we answer, that besides all that we have related above of the care taken originally in its composition and revision, and of its approval both by the Synod of Jassy, and by the four Patriarchs, it received afterwards the testimonies of Nectarius, Patriarch of [Jerusalem], whose Preface is prefixed to the edition of Panagiotti, published in 1662; and of Dositheus, Patriarch of Jerusalem, with his Synod held at Bethlehem in 1672; also at the same time of Dionysius, Patriarch of Constantinople; again, in 1691, that of a Synod held at Constantinople; and lastly, in 1696, that of Adrian, Patriarch of Moscow.

It is acknowledged by the Spiritual Regulation subscribed by Bishops and Clergy of Russia in the year 1720; and all Russian Theologians since have rested very much on this book.” (R. W. Blackmore, The Doctrine of the Russian Church, Aberdeen 1845, p. XXV)
It would appear that high level contact between the Jerusalem Patriarchate and Amsterdam publishers existed in the seventeenth centuries. This "Panagiotti" was none other than 'Panagiotis Nikousios Greek physician and the first Christian Grand Dragoman (chief interpreter) of the Ottoman Porte, holding the office from c. 1661 to his death in 1673.
Secret Alias
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Re: On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Post by Secret Alias »

It is interesting that at the time the Catholics in France were allying themselves with the Orthodox Voss was in Paris and very close to the French cause.
According to the printer's preface, Vossius' notes on the poet ‘lay in the dark for over thirty years’ (‘[p]er integros triginta & plures annos in tenebris iacuere’) before 1684, and his biographer Blok notes that he composed his commentary on Catullus ‘during the years 16’ (). 126 Vossius notes that of two epigrams of Martial ‘ita reformanda sunt lemmata, prout concipiuntur in vetustis membranis Thuanaeis’, but on the next page he proceeds to give his own reconstruction of Mart. Vossius stayed in Paris again between July 1643 and August 1644 (with interruptions), and in July and August 1650, but there are no indications that he studied manuscripts at the De Thou collection on those visits: see Blok (n. 78)
Secret Alias
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Re: On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Post by Secret Alias »

Wow to get Blok's definitive biography of Voss it's going to be $250 dollars + on Amazon! It's a two volume set with each volume snagging $125 +
StephenGoranson
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Re: On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Post by StephenGoranson »

In addition to Bart Ehrman’s 2003 comment on possible irony with a disputed “letter” (an autograph not a copy according to Charles Murgia 1976) of “Clement” (authorship disputed e.g. by Clement expert Eric Osborne 1983, based on views of gnosis, use of Eusebius, etc.) appearing after a polemic text on disputed letters of Ignatius, maybe note that in 1686 the Congregation of the Index reportedly condemned works by Isaac Vossius including his work on Ignatius’ epistles, whether the 1646 or 1680 (Cambridge/London) edition or both, and maybe his 1671 work(?), I don’t know. Based on essays in Isaac Vossius (1618-1689) Between Science and Scholarship [Leiden 2012], Vossius could be called by some, for various reasons, to borrow a collocation from the former book working title of G. Smith and B. Landau, a “rogue scholar.”
Secret Alias
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Re: On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Post by Secret Alias »

These arguments are about as persuasive as a Rorschach test.
Secret Alias
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Re: On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Post by Secret Alias »

In case anyone is interested. Since my generous academic friend INSISTS it is written in the style of a 17th century hand (I use this language to be neutral) there can be very little time between the publication and the writing. The Dutch are - like the Germans (I know Dutch people won't like the comparison) - very thorough. There is a project which has tabulated all the letters of Voss. I will figure out a way of putting it up there. I am also getting a number (I hope) on how many copies of the 1646 book were published.
Secret Alias
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Re: On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Post by Secret Alias »

Based on essays in Isaac Vossius (1618-1689) Between Science and Scholarship [Leiden 2012], Vossius could be called by some, for various reasons, to borrow a collocation from the former book working title of G. Smith and B. Landau, a “rogue scholar.”
I am interested in this. They are going after this angle?
Secret Alias
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Re: On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Post by Secret Alias »

Yes you are right (of course you are). https://liberalarts.utexas.edu/rs/faculty/gs25494 https://www.lmwsymposium.com/smith-video
He is currently working on a third book, coauthored with Brent Landau, The Secret Gospel of Mark: A Rogue Scholar, A Controversial Gospel of Jesus, and the Fierce Debate Over Its Authenticity. New Haven, CT: Yale University Press (under contract; forthcoming 2021).
Interesting. They must have that list of letters that I have from Voss.
StephenGoranson
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Re: On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Post by StephenGoranson »

I don’t know this for certain, but when I first read the (tentative or final?) forthcoming G. Smith/B. Landau book title, The Secret Gospel of Mark: A Rogue Scholar, A Controversial Gospel of Jesus, and the Fierce Debate Over Its Authenticity (Yale UP), I assumed that the rogue scholar meant was Morton Smith. Now, as it happens, the volume in which someone penned this bizarre ms was published by the learned Isaac Voss (Vossius), who also was regarded by some of his contemporaries as, in effect, a rogue scholar (and “famous,” Smith, 1973, page 13). Possibly, Morton might have liked (and have chosen?) Voss, learned rogue.
Secret Alias
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Re: On the Possible Connection Between Jerusalem and Amsterdam

Post by Secret Alias »

Nope. I talked with Geoffrey. Told him how much you like his presentation. But he said no, not working on the Voss angle. Thanks anyway.
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