Is There Compelling Evidence the Valentinians Were Especially Attached to the Rest of Gospel of John After the Prologue?

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Secret Alias
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Is There Compelling Evidence the Valentinians Were Especially Attached to the Rest of Gospel of John After the Prologue?

Post by Secret Alias »

Just asking. I think it was just the prologue. And maybe the reference to the Paraclete.
Last edited by Secret Alias on Sat Mar 28, 2020 11:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
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Stuart
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Re: Is There Compelling Evidence the Valentinians Paid Were Especially Attached to the Rest of G John After the Prologue

Post by Stuart »

I assume the word "Paid" is accidentally in the title (makes it a nonsense sentence).

I can and have made the case the first version of the Gospel of John was written by a Gnostic, possibly a Cainite.

Did the Valentinians think John the Baptist belonged to the High God, father of Jesus, or did they think he belonged to the Jewish God/Creator?

The first author of John placed John as coming from the High God against the creator, rejecting the last prophet theology of the Synoptics. He also made Judas the trusted disciple. (These positions were held by neither the Marcionites nor the proto-Orthodox)

Like the Marcionites the author saw Abraham as the common ancestor of both Jews and Gentiles, and thus the bridge point between Jews/Jewish Christians (Catholics) and Gnostic type Christians. Moses is seen as the starting point of the Jewish tribal God's intervention, signified by the law. Also like the Marcionites, Jesus raises himself from the dead and does not need the father's help to do so (clear distinction from Catholics).

Unlike the Marcionites, Jesus is preexisting, present at creation and the creation happened through him (we see this also suggested in Paul, but that proves nothing as Paul is a composite of tracts melded together into pseudo letters). The author also rejects Mary as the mother of Jesus.

Many of these points do not align with the Valentinians, but some do. They do seem to align more with the Cainites, although we know very little about them beyond the notion that Judas was the best disciple because he was the one trusted to hand him over to the authorities working for "the Archon (ruler) of the World" to fulfill his mission. If my reading is correct, then John would have been useful, but not critical for the Valentinians.
“’That was excellently observed’, say I, when I read a passage in an author, where his opinion agrees with mine. When we differ, there I pronounce him to be mistaken.” - Jonathan Swift
andrewcriddle
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Re: Is There Compelling Evidence the Valentinians Were Especially Attached to the Rest of Gospel of John After the Prolo

Post by andrewcriddle »

Secret Alias wrote: Sat Mar 28, 2020 9:42 am Just asking. I think it was just the prologue. And maybe the reference to the Paraclete.
Well Heracleon wrote a commentary on John

Andrew Criddle
Secret Alias
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Re: Is There Compelling Evidence the Valentinians Were Especially Attached to the Rest of Gospel of John After the Prolo

Post by Secret Alias »

That was in my original post. But he also wrote one on Luke. What about Valentinus himself or earlier Valentinians? My original title used the word preferred. I guess I am trying to contextualize Irenaeus's assignment of gospels to particular groups. Was it exclusive in the case of the alleged Johannine attachment of the Valentinians? I say no.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
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