From Hadrian, to Barnabas, to Marcion

Discussion about the New Testament, apocrypha, gnostics, church fathers, Christian origins, historical Jesus or otherwise, etc.
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Giuseppe
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Re: From Hadrian, to Barnabas, to Marcion

Post by Giuseppe » Tue Feb 18, 2020 7:14 am

Joseph D. L. wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 6:37 am
Giuseppe wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:43 am
Joseph D. L. wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:29 am
Seriously think about this.

Giuseppe argues that it was the “Judiazers” who invented Barabbas.

And who were these ”Judiazers”? According to Giuseppe, the proto-Orthodox, who hated Jews and Marcionites alike (again, according to him.)
you are ignorant. RG Price has explained in short lines the meaning of a Gospel written by Jews for Jews: the Jews kill their Christ, therefore YHWH kills the Jews.

You are simply an idiot if this means that the Jewish author "hated" the Jews.
Where is this mysterious Gospel then?
Gospel of Mark.
I don't give a good goddamn what you think Price says or doesn't say.
RG Price agrees with me about GMark, here, idiot.
The Gospels as we have them--as we know them--shows the Jews rejecting their Christ, and the Romans crucifying him.

And yet you would have us believe that this is really some ploy against the Marcionites by... who?!? No one.
You are false. Never said that. Only Barabbas episode is anti-Marcion.
the Jews kill their Christ, therefore YHWH kills the Jews.
That's not how it works you idiota. The Jews rejecting their Christ is a typical Jewish theme,
Accordingly, the Barabbas episode is invented by Jews, since only Jews would invent a Jewish Jesus called Christ killed by Jews.
That's it. You've simply never read the Old Testament. That's the only reason I can think of for your absolute ignorance. You simply have never read these texts.
I seriously think that you are the guy who has never read the Old and the New Testament, here.
Nihil enim in speciem fallacius est quam prava religio. -Liv. xxxix. 16.

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Joseph D. L.
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Re: From Hadrian, to Barnabas, to Marcion

Post by Joseph D. L. » Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:15 am

Giuseppe wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 7:14 am
Gospel of Mark.

And as soon as it was morning, the chief priests held a consultation with the elders and scribes and the whole council. And they bound Jesus and led him away and delivered him over to Pilate. 2 And Pilate asked him, “Are you the King of the Jews?” And he answered him, “You have said so.” 3 And the chief priests accused him of many things. 4 And Pilate again asked him, “Have you no answer to make? See how many charges they bring against you.” 5 But Jesus made no further answer, so that Pilate was amazed.

Pilate Delivers Jesus to Be Crucified
6 Now at the feast he used to release for them one prisoner for whom they asked. 7 And among the rebels in prison, who had committed murder in the insurrection, there was a man called Barabbas. 8 And the crowd came up and began to ask Pilate to do as he usually did for them. 9 And he answered them, saying, “Do you want me to release for you the King of the Jews?” 10 For he perceived that it was out of envy that the chief priests had delivered him up. 11 But the chief priests stirred up the crowd to have him release for them Barabbas instead. 12 And Pilate again said to them, “Then what shall I do with the man you call the King of the Jews?” 13 And they cried out again, “Crucify him.” 14 And Pilate said to them, “Why? What evil has he done?” But they shouted all the more, “Crucify him.” 15 So Pilate, wishing to satisfy the crowd, released for them Barabbas, and having scourged[a] Jesus, he delivered him to be crucified.

Jesus Is Mocked
16 And the soldiers led him away inside the palace (that is, the governor's headquarters), and they called together the whole battalion.[c] 17 And they clothed him in a purple cloak, and twisting together a crown of thorns, they put it on him. 18 And they began to salute him, “Hail, King of the Jews!” 19 And they were striking his head with a reed and spitting on him and kneeling down in homage to him. 20 And when they had mocked him, they stripped him of the purple cloak and put his own clothes on him. And they led him out to crucify him.

The Crucifixion
21 And they compelled a passerby, Simon of Cyrene, who was coming in from the country, the father of Alexander and Rufus, to carry his cross. 22 And they brought him to the place called Golgotha (which means Place of a Skull). 23 And they offered him wine mixed with myrrh, but he did not take it. 24 And they crucified him and divided his garments among them, casting lots for them, to decide what each should take. 25 And it was the third hour[d] when they crucified him. 26 And the inscription of the charge against him read, “The King of the Jews.” 27 And with him they crucified two robbers, one on his right and one on his left.[e] 29 And those who passed by derided him, wagging their heads and saying, “Aha! You who would destroy the temple and rebuild it in three days, 30 save yourself, and come down from the cross!” 31 So also the chief priests with the scribes mocked him to one another, saying, “He saved others; he cannot save himself. 32 Let the Christ, the King of Israel, come down now from the cross that we may see and believe.” Those who were crucified with him also reviled him.

The Death of Jesus
33 And when the sixth hour[f] had come, there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour.[g] 34 And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, “Eloi, Eloi, lema sabachthani?” which means, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” 35 And some of the bystanders hearing it said, “Behold, he is calling Elijah.” 36 And someone ran and filled a sponge with sour wine, put it on a reed and gave it to him to drink, saying, “Wait, let us see whether Elijah will come to take him down.” 37 And Jesus uttered a loud cry and breathed his last. 38 And the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom. 39 And when the centurion, who stood facing him, saw that in this way he[h] breathed his last, he said, “Truly this man was the Son of God!”

40 There were also women looking on from a distance, among whom were Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the younger and of Joses, and Salome. 41 When he was in Galilee, they followed him and ministered to him, and there were also many other women who came up with him to Jerusalem.



Nope. Jews reject Jesus in favour of Barabbas. Romans crucify Jesus. The Sanhedrin don't stone Jesus to death and hang his body on tree.

So you've never read the Gospels either.

RG Price agrees with me about GMark, here, idiot.


Then you're both wrong. I have no allegiance to anyone.

You are false. Never said that. Only Barabbas episode is anti-Marcion.


So the Barabbas episode is anti-Marcionite alone? Then what does that make of the Romans killing Christ? If the Judiazers were inserting and adding in things, why not just reverse everything?

Accordingly, the Barabbas episode is invented by Jews, since only Jews would invent a Jewish Jesus called Christ killed by Jews.


While you have said earlier that the Barabbas episode was invented by the Judiazers, whom you later call the proto-Orthodox and said that the hated the Jews, and was so to give the middle-finger to the Marcionites.

You're idiocy knows no limits.

I seriously think that you are the guy who has never read the Old and the New Testament, here.


Well, considering I was in the process of converting to Judaism, I would say I had to read the Old Testament.

Then again, you're the one claiming the text means one thing when it clearly states that it's the Jews betraying Jesus, the gentile Marcionites.

So you'v never read anything beyond Carrier, Price, and other mythicists.
Last edited by Joseph D. L. on Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:19 am, edited 2 times in total.

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