Is Romans 13:11 a Failed Prediction?

[Bernard Muller]

The future orientation of Paul is manifest. There are no arguments in Paul that he had a second coming of Jesus in mind.

What about:
1 Th 2:19 "For what is our hope or joy or crown of boasting before our Lord Jesus at his coming? Is it not you?"
1 Th 3:13 "so that he may establish your hearts unblamable in holiness before our God and Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus with all his saints."
1 Th 5:23 "May the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be kept sound and blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ."

Cordially, Bernard

[Ben C. Smith]

The future orientation of Paul is manifest. There are no arguments in Paul that he had a second coming of Jesus in mind.

What about:
1 Th 2:19 "For what is our hope or joy or crown of boasting before our Lord Jesus at his coming? Is it not you?"
1 Th 3:13 "so that he may establish your hearts unblamable in holiness before our God and Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus with all his saints."
1 Th 5:23 "May the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be kept sound and blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ."

Frans' emphasis was on a second coming. Those verses speak of a coming, but it is difficult to pin Paul down as saying explicitly that this future coming is a second one, a return.

[Bernard Muller]

to Ben,

Frans' emphasis was on a second coming. Those verses speak of a coming, but it is difficult to pin Paul down as saying explicitly that this future coming is a second one, a return.

But Paul alluded to a first coming in the past:
1 Corinthians 1:23 "But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;" ("crucified": perfect, passive, participle)
Same in 1 Corinthians 2:2 for "crucified"
Same in Galatians 3:1 for "crucified"

Cordially, Bernard

[iskander]

Galatian 4:4
But when the fullness of time had come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law ...

[Ben C. Smith]

to Ben,

Frans' emphasis was on a second coming. Those verses speak of a coming, but it is difficult to pin Paul down as saying explicitly that this future coming is a second one, a return.

But Paul alluded to a first coming in the past:
1 Corinthians 1:23 "But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;" ("crucified": perfect, passive, participle)
Same in 1 Corinthians 2:2 for "crucified"
Same in Galatians 3:1 for "crucified"

I tend to agree, but Frans has already made clear that he regards all of those passages as spurious.

[iskander]

.. then this silly discussion has gone on for too long.

[readyforchange]

RFC, below some suggested reading for a fresh outlook on Paul:
• Beck, Norman A., Anti-Roman Cryptograms in the New Testament - Symbolic Messages of Hope and Liberation
• Walker, William O., Interpolations in the Pauline Letters
• Segal, Alan F., Paul the Convert
• Crossan, John D. and Jonathan L. Reed, In Search of Paul – How Jesus’ Apostle Opposed Rome’s Empire with God’s Kingdom
• Vermeiren, Frans J., A Chronological Revision of the Origins of Christianity.

Frans, thanks for the references here. I will also plan to check out your book.