Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Discussion about the New Testament, apocrypha, gnostics, church fathers, Christian origins, historical Jesus or otherwise, etc.
Secret Alias
Posts: 18922
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:47 am

Re: Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Post by Secret Alias »

Here's some evidence. Seraphim was in the monastery when Morton Smith found the manuscript. Morton Smith called him his "old friend" and took a close up photo of him (showing intimacy) and included in his book. He also took a photo of the Patriarch of Jerusalem and kept him appraised of his discovery. The idea that Morton Smith kept this a secret from men he considered his friends is less likely than the fact he shared the information with them. Not that he knew it was a secret gospel of Mark but that he found a letter of Clement. The idea that suspicions weren't raised IMMEDIATELY when he drew attention to this unique looking book (no cover) writing in the rear pages is crazy. Yes it's theoretically possible that he could have brought a book with him. But then to draw attention to the book 24 hours after discovering it and Seraphim embraced the text was attached to the book. As I said it assumes a racist view of ignorant non-WASPs. It's like early movies where non-whites are shown as ignorant savages. You wouldn't think an American, British or German manager of a library was so completely stupid. There's nothing to do in a monastery. The books were their sole passive leisure activity (besides probably whacking off in their cells). Maybe every monks didn't know every book in their library. But Seraphim who had been there for over twenty five years. I bet he had fairly good idea about a coverless Latin Greek edition of Ignatius ESPECIALLY SINCE HIS MASTER MONK WAS NAMED IGNATIUS.
Last edited by Secret Alias on Tue Apr 16, 2024 10:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Peter Kirby
Site Admin
Posts: 8629
Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2013 2:13 pm
Location: Santa Clara
Contact:

Re: Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Post by Peter Kirby »

As a moderator, I think you've made your point re: alleged racism.

Please now tone it down ("be moderate").
Secret Alias
Posts: 18922
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:47 am

Re: Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Post by Secret Alias »

I accused all Western scholars in this debate of this both forgery and authenticity promoters just as I mentioned people who "prefer" Morton Smith's amateur renderings over the expertise of Tselikas are on both sides of the debate. I think all participants in this debate by ignoring Tselikas and not even considering the opinion of the Greek Orthodox witnesses exhibited racism and racist leanings. I will shut up.
Last edited by Secret Alias on Tue Apr 16, 2024 10:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Peter Kirby
Site Admin
Posts: 8629
Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2013 2:13 pm
Location: Santa Clara
Contact:

Re: Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Post by Peter Kirby »

Secret Alias wrote: Tue Apr 16, 2024 10:06 am unique looking book (no cover)
According to Morton Smith's book: "The front cover and the title page were lost (most of the books in the tower library had lived hard lives), and there was nothing on the spine, but..." (p. 13)
Secret Alias
Posts: 18922
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:47 am

Re: Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Post by Secret Alias »

There you go. But only a few of them had writing in the back. And this was extensive writing. I had a copy of El Cid when I was a kid with extensive handwritten notes from someone. I remembered that book.
User avatar
Peter Kirby
Site Admin
Posts: 8629
Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2013 2:13 pm
Location: Santa Clara
Contact:

Re: Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Post by Peter Kirby »

By the way: am I crazy for wondering about this or was Smith possibly assigned a ghostwriter for The Secret Gospel? Someone who helped Smith do the writing part, making it read better.
Secret Alias
Posts: 18922
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:47 am

Re: Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Post by Secret Alias »

Tselikas hints at that. It would explain (sort of) the "naked man with naked man" error and the misreading of the abbreviations of kuriou. Only so far you can go with that. Why didn't he ask the scribe to tell him what was there.
Secret Alias
Posts: 18922
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:47 am

Re: Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Post by Secret Alias »

But then you've officially crossed the line and become a conspiracy theory.
Secret Alias
Posts: 18922
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:47 am

Re: Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Post by Secret Alias »

I mentioned that after p 144 of that publication of the journal of Seraphim there are original photos of his handwriting. Imagine if it looks like the Mar Saba document. Would explain a lot about Tselikas's avoiding the conspiracy theory. But we have to wait and see.
Secret Alias
Posts: 18922
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:47 am

Re: Greek Monks Who Thought the Letter to Theodore was in the Mar Saba Monastery Before Morton Smith Arrives

Post by Secret Alias »

His teacher was an Igumen not Ignatius. Incorrect reporting by me.
Post Reply