Book review of Gilad Atzmon's The Wandering Who?

[JoeWallack]

I'm going home to Israel

JW:
Chapter 7 Part 1

Here are some quotes that reveal what early Zionist ideologists thought of their brothers, the Diaspora Jews, those for whom they were developing a nationalist project based on a philosophy of racial ethnic identity:

‘The Jew is a caricature of a normal, natural human being, both physically and spiritually. As an individual in society he revolts and throws off the harness of social obligations, knows no order nor discipline.’

‘The fact is undeniable that the Jews, collectively, are unhealthy and neurotic. Those professional Jews who, wounded to the quick, indignantly deny this truth are the greatest enemies of their race, for they thereby lead them to search for false solutions, or at most palliatives.’

‘The emancipated Jew is insecure in his relations with his fellow-beings, timid with strangers, suspicious even toward the secret feeling of his friends. His best powers are exhausted in the suppression, or at least in the difficult concealment of his own real character. For he fears that this character might be recognised as Jewish, and he has never the satisfaction of showing himself as he is, in all his thoughts and sentiments. He becomes an inner cripple, and externally unreal, and thereby always ridiculous and hateful to all higher-feeling men, as is everything that is unreal. All the better Jews in Western Europe groan under this, or seek for alleviation. They no longer possess the belief which gives the patience necessary to bear sufferings, because it sees in them the will of a punishing but not loving God.’

Based on the few quotes above by "early Zionists" Atzmon claims that this describes "The Jews"/Zionists. They recognized that they were evil and wicked and thought that by having their own country like everyone else they could be like everyone else, not evil and wicked. Or, inspired by the Holocaust and 2,000 years of evil and wicked Christians and Muslims, they correctly saw that they could only count on a Jewish country to protect Jews (talk about prophetic!). You would think that Godfree would know what proof-texting is by now.

Atzmon, apparently because he does still have some Judaism inside, does have the foresight here to see that someone like Godfree might try to weasel word the above into not what Atzmon thinks, just what Atzmon's target thinks, so Atzmon adds the following:

In their emerging fantasy of national awakening, Jews would divorce from greed and money

Atzmon's words, not a quote.

emancipated secular Jews have very little to offer in terms of positive characteristics to identify with.

Emancipated Jews are identified by negation - they are defined by the many things they are not.

Another contradiction. Now secular Jews, which is most Jews, are not Jews first.

Zionism has failed for various reasons. Zionism could never have prevailed. It has been entangled with an endless list of sins from day one. Yet, as much as Zionism quickly established itself as a criminal practice,

Zionism has "failed" yet he previously "proved" that Zionism controls the world. The only consistency in this book is the Jews/Zionists are always described negatively. His chapter title is "The Dialectic of Negation". He is supposedly arguing that secular Jews are defined by negation but is his title a troll clue that he will only describe "The Jews" negatively?


Joseph

The New Porphyry

[iskander]

Were idolaters anti-Semite?
Exodus 32:26-28
26.So Moses stood in the gate of the camp and said: "Whoever is for the Lord, [let him come] to me!" And all the sons of Levi gathered around him.
27.He said to them: "So said the Lord, the God of Israel: 'Let every man place his sword upon his thigh and pass back and forth from one gate to the other in the camp, and let every man kill his brother, every man his friend, every man his kinsman.'
28.The sons of Levi did according to Moses' word; on that day some three thousand men fell from among the people.



Gilad Atzmon asks this question , But why do they hate so much?
attachment

ga page 54.PNG (50.09 KiB) Viewed 6173 times

[neilgodfrey]

Politics of Negation

.... During my years in Europe I have come across groups of people who call themselves ‘Jews for
Peace’, ‘Jews for Justice in Palestine’, ‘Jews Against Zionism’, ‘Jews for this’ and ‘Jews for that’. I
have recently heard about ‘Jews for Boycott of Israeli Goods’. Occasionally I end up asking myself
what stands at the core of this ethnocentric, separatist, peace-loving endeavour. I may as well admit
that though I have come across many German peace activists, I have never come across an ‘Aryan
Palestinian Solidarity’, ‘Aryan for Peace’ group or even Caucasian Anti-War campaigners. It is
somehow Jews and only Jews who engage in racially-orientated or ethno-centric peace and solidarity
campaigning.

.....

More frightening is the fact that people who succumb to the dialectic of negation cannot engage
in peace-making and reconciliation. The reason is simple: the notion of peace, reconciliation and
harmony entails a collapse of the politics of negation. From the point of view of negation,
reconciliation means elimination. Loving your neighbour may lead towards an identity loss. Needless
to say that in the last centuries, millions of European and American Jews have chosen peace and total
assimilation. They have divorced their Jewish identity and disappeared into the masses.

pp. 62ff from The Wandering Who

[neilgodfrey]

‘The emancipated Jew is insecure in his relations with his fellow-beings, timid with strangers, suspicious even toward the secret feeling of his friends. His best powers are exhausted in the suppression, or at least in the difficult concealment of his own real character. For he fears that this character might be recognised as Jewish, and he has never the satisfaction of showing himself as he is, in all his thoughts and sentiments. He becomes an inner cripple, and externally unreal, and thereby always ridiculous and hateful to all higher-feeling men, as is everything that is unreal. All the better Jews in Western Europe groan under this, or seek for alleviation. They no longer possess the belief which gives the patience necessary to bear sufferings, because it sees in them the will of a punishing but not loving God.’

Joe, I invite you to read The Pity of It All by Amos Elon or even The Jewish Century by Yuri Slezkine where you see historical evidence of the above. You seem to find it necessary to add your own distorted interpretations to Atzmon's words and cannot let them just speak for themselves. You don't seem to be interested in self-reflection or understanding. But you sure express a lot of hate for people like me. Wonder why.

[JoeWallack]

JW:
Chapter 7 Part Jew

I have never come across an ‘Aryan Palestinian Solidarity’, ‘Aryan for Peace’ group or even Caucasian Anti-War campaigners. It is somehow Jews and only Jews who engage in racially-orientated or ethno-centric peace and solidarity campaigning. Borochov and Nordau provided us with a possible answer. In the seeking of a ‘political identity’,

Again with the Nazi comparison and "The Jews" compare unfavorably. Ya gotta hate this guy. I would tell this to The Black Caucus except that when John Lewis heard he would say, "Ain't that a mutherfucker".

They are Jews because they aren’t anything else. At a first glance it seems as if nothing is wrong in being defined by negation. Yet, a deeper critical glance into the notion of negation may reveal some of the devastating aspects of this form of emancipated dialectic.

First "The Jews" are criticized because they are too something (Jewish). Then they are criticized because they are too nothing. This type of glaring antisemitic contradiction makes me think he is not being serious.

The Israelis take a special pride in the IDF’s ‘code of ethics’ (a set of principles that define ‘The IDF Spirit: Values and Basic Rules’). Israelis claim that the IDF is the only army in the world to possess an ‘ethical code’.

Evidence that the Israelis are more ethical not less. I was disappointed in Atzmon's spin on this, he was not able to negate its significance or twist it into evidence of being less ethical. An ethical standard for the IDF that is publicly enforced by the Israeli government. That's a tough one to deny. Edisemitic fatigue I guess.

The Westerner subject who is stained with the crime of genocide is also a victim of the Western shift towards politics of negation. Rather than defining ourselves by who we are, we get accustomed to our politicians defining us by whom we suppose to hate: once it was the ‘Nazi’, then the ‘Red’, then it was the ‘axis of evil’ and now it is the ‘Islamofascists’. The list is obviously open to changes.

Again with the Nazi comparison. Apparently there are no newspapers in Jazz Clubs. Otherwise he would know that [understatement] genocide and hate is not limited to the West.[/understatement] He has no problem accusing Israel of genocide and hate but any such accusations of Palestinians/Arabs/Muslims is strictly verboten (that automatically makes you an Islamophobe).

More frightening is the fact that people who succumb to the dialectic of negation cannot engage in peace-making and reconciliation. The reason is simple: the notion of peace, reconciliation and harmony entails a collapse of the politics of negation. From the point of view of negation, reconciliation means elimination. Loving your neighbour may lead towards an identity loss.

I would really like to see the look on his face while he is saying this.

However, the fact that emancipated Jewish identity is defined by negation may also help us to realise why it is that emancipated Jews are so often part of political campaigns and revolutionary movements: those who are defined by negation are always against something. It could be the bourgeoisie, capitalism, colonialism, Palestinians, Iraq, Iran, Islam, the Goyim, human rights abuse, historic revisionism, Zionism and so forth. Seemingly, the journey between ‘dialectic of negation’ and ‘politics of hate’ is rather short.

A "fact" not supported by any survey, study or research. My guess is "The Jews" are more likely to be activists. Most people are not activists and most Jews are not activists. Let's say 10% of Jews are activists and 5% of non Jews are activists. So in this example Jews are twice as likely. So what. The average Jews is still not an activist and the default for activism is you are just as likely to be on the good side as the bad side. This could only be used as evidence that "The Jews"/Zionists are evil and wicked and control the world if you start with that conclusion. Atzmon keeps claiming that all the hate is on "The Jews" side, yet he is the one who exhibits the hate along with his fellow Jew haters. "Mark's" Jesus would be sore amazed how much easier it is to find Israeli/Zionist/"The Jews" terrorist books on Amazon than Palestinian/Arab/"The Muslims" terrorist books. I probably have the typical Jewish reaction to Atzmon's piece of shit book, it doesn't make me want to write a book claiming The Palestinians/Arabs/Muslims are evil and wicked and want to control the world because there's no evidence for that conclusion and I don't think they are/do. The worst it makes me do is think this is funny:




Joseph

The New Porphyry

[neilgodfrey]

LOL!!! Oh Joe, you are a card, aren't you!

Let's see how you interpret this one:

I did not yet realize that my emerging devotion to jazz had overwhelmed my Jewish nationalist tendencies; that it was probably then and there that I left Chosen-ness behind to become an ordinary human being. Years later, I would indeed come to see that jazz had been my escape route. (p. 4)

Your interpretations are so bizarre in their utter inability to comprehend the most basic meaning of Atzmon's words and your inability to read them without searing hatred that you are quite frankly a caricature.

Do you really truly believe that anyone who reads Atzmon's words or that Atzmon himself really is guilty of the mindset you see in those words?

Hey, I invite you to listen to a little jazz, too -- maybe even go out and talk to a Palestinian!!!! --- actually get to know the people in whom you see so much hate and that you yourself evidently hate and fear.

Why don't you relax a little, lower your fear and hatred level by just a notch, peer over the top and see if only for a moment that those you despise really are not what you fear or hear after all. Maybe what you hear and see in others is what is really deep down inside you!

[neilgodfrey]

JW:
Chapter 7 Part Jew

I have never come across an ‘Aryan Palestinian Solidarity’, ‘Aryan for Peace’ group or even Caucasian Anti-War campaigners. It is somehow Jews and only Jews who engage in racially-orientated or ethno-centric peace and solidarity campaigning. Borochov and Nordau provided us with a possible answer. In the seeking of a ‘political identity’,

Again with the Nazi comparison and "The Jews" compare unfavorably. Ya gotta hate this guy. I would tell this to The Black Caucus except that when John Lewis heard he would say, "Ain't that a mutherfucker".

etc etc etc etc

Wheh! Thanks for jumping in and telling us how to read Atzmon, Joe. If it were left to me we would only have Atzmon's own words standing there for people to read without clear direction from you to tell them the correct interpretation and meaning. Can't have that, can we!

[neilgodfrey]

The Wandering Who, pages 187-189 -- words of love and peace and justice and our common humanity.....

Imagine an Israeli PM wakes up one sunny morning with the unusual determination to bring about true peace. In the wee small hours, wisdom embraces him or her. He or she realises that Israel is in fact Palestine: it is stretched over historic Palestine at the expense of the Palestinian people, their livelihood and their history. He or she grasps that the Palestinians are the indigenous people of the land, and the rockets they shoot from time to time are nothing but love letters to their stolen villages, orchards, vineyards and fields. Our imaginary Israeli PM realises that the so-called Israeli-Palestinian conflict can be resolved in 25 minutes once both people decide to live together. Following the Israeli unilateral tradition, an immediate televised press conference is called on the same day at 14:00. Captivated by true righteousness, the PM announces to the world and his/her people ‘Israel realises its unique circumstances and its responsibility for world peace. Israel calls the Palestinian people to return to their homes. The Jewish state is to become a state of its citizens, where all people enjoy full equal rights’.

Though shocked by the sudden Israeli move, political analysts around the world would be quick to realise that, considering Israel is the representative of world Jewry, such a simple peaceful initiative won’t just resolve the conflict in the Middle East, it would also bring to an end two millennia of mutual suspicion and resentfulness between Christians and Jews. Some right-wing Israeli academics, ideologists and politicians join the revolutionary initiative and declare that such a heroic unilateral Israeli act could be the one and only total and comprehensive fulfilment of the Zionist dream, for not only have Jews returned to their alleged historical home, they also have managed, at last, to love their neighbours and be loved in return.

As much as such an idea is thrilling, we shouldn’t expect it to happen any time soon, for Israel is the Jewish state and Jewishness is an ethno-centric ideology driven by exclusiveness, exceptionalism, racial supremacy and a deep inherent inclination toward segregation.

For Israel and Israelis to become people like other people, all traces of Jewish ideological superiority must be eliminated first. For the Jewish state to lead a peace initiative, Israel must be de-Zionised – it should first stop being the Jewish State. Similarly, in order for an imaginary Israeli PM to bring peace about, he or she must be de-Zionised first.

As things stand, the Jewish State is categorically unable to lead the region into reconciliation. It lacks the necessary ingredients needed to think in terms of harmony and reconciliation.

The only people who can bring peace about are the Palestinians, because Palestine, against all odds and in spite of the endless suffering, humiliation and oppression, is still an ethically-driven ecumenical society.

As far as Jews are concerned, a few questions remain. Can the Jewish identity discourse be liberated from its self-imposed ideological and spiritual tyranny? Can Jewish politics drift away from supremacy? Can Jews save themselves? My answer is simple: for Jewish ideology to universalise itself and for Jews to move on and emancipate themselves, a vigorous and honest process of self-reflection must take place. Whether Jews can engage in such a critical endeavour is an open question. I don’t know the answer, I guess that some can, others can’t. I would hope, though, that this book may offer a fairly good start.

"Others can't". Some of those others will take the above and add their own commentary to argue that the above words are in fact racist, intolerant, hateful, even nazi-like. Any book attempting to help those particular others to emancipate themselves from their fears and hatreds must not be allowed to speak for itself. It must be met with a perverse interpretation that paints its author and appreciative readers as terrorist loving anti-semites. Hence Atzmon's feeling a need to write the book in the first place.

[JoeWallack]

JW:
Judea declares War on Obama by Gilad Atzmon

Jewish lobbies certainly do not hold back when it comes to pressuring states, world leaders and even super powers. AIPAC’s behavior last week reminded me of the Jewish declaration of war against Nazi Germany in 1933.

Not many people are aware that in March 1933, long before Hitler became the undisputed leader of Germany and began restricting the rights of German Jews, the American Jewish Congress announced a massive protest at Madison Square Gardens and called for an American boycott of German goods.

I obviously do not think that Obama has anything in common with Hitler. There is not much the two leaders share in terms of their philosophy, their attitude to humanism or their view of world peace.(1) However, it is hard to turn a blind eye to the similarity between AIPAC’s behaviour last week and the Jewish American Congress’ conduct in 1933.

On March 24, 1933, The Daily Express (London) published an article announcing that the Jews had already launched their boycott against Germany and threatened a forthcoming "holy war". The Express urged Jews everywhere to boycott German goods and demonstrate actively against German economic interests.

The Express said that Germany was "now confronted with an international boycott of its trade, its finances, and its industry....in London, New York, Paris and Warsaw, Jewish businessmen are united to go on an economic crusade."

Jewish texts tend to glaze over the fact that Hitler's March 28 1933, ordering a boycott against Jewish stores and goods, was an escalation in direct response to the declaration of war on Germany by the worldwide Jewish leadership. In fact the only Jewish enclave that is willing to admit the historical order of events that led to the destruction of European Jewry, is the anti Zionist Jewish Orthodox sect known as the Torah Jews. I assume that, similarly, once things turn sour between America and its Jewish lobbies, Jewish tribal ideologists will be the first to forget that it was the Jewish American establishment that worked so hard to nourish the inevitable animosity.

JW:
THE BOYCOTT OF JEWISH BUSINESSES

KEY DATES
MARCH 1933
SA REIGN OF TERROR AGAINST JEWS THROUGHOUT GERMANY
The SA (Storm Troopers) attack Jewish-owned department stores in German cities in an attempt to segregate Jews from the rest of society. Local police, not yet under Nazi control, unsuccessfully attempt to stop the attacks. Members of the SA continue the rampage and enter courtrooms, dragging Jewish lawyers and judges into the streets where they are subjected to humiliating public acts. These attacks are publicized by international Jewish organizations and the press, which urge a boycott of German goods. In response, the Nazis organize a nationwide boycott of Jewish businesses in Germany, blaming Jews for anti-German tone of the international press.

APRIL 1, 1933
NATIONWIDE BOYCOTT OF JEWISH-OWNED BUSINESSES
At 10:00 a.m., SA and SS members stand in front of Jewish-owned businesses throughout Germany to inform the public that the proprietors of these establishments are Jewish. The word "Jude," German for "Jew," is often smeared on store display windows, with a Star of David painted in yellow and black across the doors. Anti-Jewish signs accompany these slogans. In some towns, the SA marches through the streets singing anti-Jewish slogans and party songs. In other towns, violence accompanies the boycott; in Kiel, a Jewish lawyer is killed. The official boycott ends at midnight.

So historically the Nazi/German attack against "The Jews" was first. Hitler was already named Chancellor anyway and Mein Kampf was written long before. So Atzmon, who I assume can read and write (unless Neil Godfree wrote his book for him and iskander proofed it which would explain some things), is (again) a lying antisemitic piece of shit. To have most of my relatives murdered by Nazis in Christian Europe and have to read this shit, that "The Jews" provoked Hitler. Fuck.

To suggest that this "person" who constantly says "The Jews" are Nazis and The Palestinians are their Jewish victims and adds that "The Jews" provoked Hitler into murdering them is going to stop Palestinian Terrorism and bring peace to The Middle East, wtfatwa.


Joseph

The New Porphyry

[iskander]

Were idolaters anti-Semite?
Exodus 32:26-28
26.So Moses stood in the gate of the camp and said: "Whoever is for the Lord, [let him come] to me!" And all the sons of Levi gathered around him.
27.He said to them: "So said the Lord, the God of Israel: 'Let every man place his sword upon his thigh and pass back and forth from one gate to the other in the camp, and let every man kill his brother, every man his friend, every man his kinsman.'
28.The sons of Levi did according to Moses' word; on that day some three thousand men fell from among the people.



Gilad Atzmon asks this question , But why do they hate so much?
attachment
ga page 54.PNG

Chapter 7 , the old story of left versus right politics : the common history of all men and women
To or not to be :
Attachment