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by Peter Kirby
Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:29 am
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: A lengthy note on Hebrews 9.24 (into heaven itself).
Replies: 79
Views: 43491

Re: A lengthy note on Hebrews 9.24 (into heaven itself).

Here are the references in Christian writings. Novum Testamentum, Epistula Pauli ad Hebraeos Chapter 9, section 24, line 3 ἀλλ' εἰς αὐτὸν τὸν οὐρανόν, "PHILOSOPHERS" Joannes Philoponus Phil., De opificio mundi Page 132, line 21 [6th century] ὥστε καὶ αὐτὸς ὁ οὐρανός Joannes Philoponus Phil...
by Peter Kirby
Fri Jun 12, 2015 12:15 am
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: A brief note on Hebrews 5.5-6 (when Jesus becomes priest).
Replies: 75
Views: 30847

Re: A brief note on Hebrews 5.5-6 (when Jesus becomes priest

I am really enjoying this series of notes on Hebrews. Thank you for the work put into it!
by Peter Kirby
Thu Jun 11, 2015 11:34 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Did the Church Fathers Really Take ΙΣ = Jesus?
Replies: 108
Views: 91275

Re: Did the Church Fathers Really Take ΙΣ = Jesus?

Stephan Huller wrote:When Jerome becomes a turn coat he refers to Eusebius falsifying more than Origen.
This is interesting. Could you track down and share the exact reference with us?
by Peter Kirby
Thu Jun 11, 2015 8:44 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Historicity of Paul, apostle and letter-writer
Replies: 87
Views: 44790

Re: Historicity of Paul, apostle and letter-writer

As a side note, in connection with PK's stylometric analysis of Paul's epistles: Did you try putting known Pauline forgeries like 3Cor (or the letter to Seneca) into the mix to see how they get assessed? Are there any other famous Pauline forgeries which are extant? I did assess Hebrews; it doesn't...
by Peter Kirby
Thu Jun 11, 2015 6:43 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: A lengthy note on Hebrews 9.24 (into heaven itself).
Replies: 79
Views: 43491

Re: A lengthy note on Hebrews 9.24 (into heaven itself).

If there are counter-examples, I want to know about them. (I found the examples I used with the free version of the TLG, but I was not exhaustive.) Sure thing. I'm not really looking for counter-examples. I think we can take a survey of the use of the phrase and attempt to reason on the basis of th...
by Peter Kirby
Thu Jun 11, 2015 5:45 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: A lengthy note on Hebrews 9.24 (into heaven itself).
Replies: 79
Views: 43491

Re: A lengthy note on Hebrews 9.24 (into heaven itself).

Side note here [more of a note to self, but useful to anyone else hunting or curious]: I'm looking for αὐτὸς in the predicate position with the articular noun, in agreement with Hebrews 9:24. So that means: ὁ οὐρανὸς αὐτὸς αὐτὸς ὁ οὐρανὸς τοῦ οὐρανοῦ αὐτοῦ αὐτοῦ τοῦ οὐρανοῦ τῷ οὐρανῷ αὐτῷ αὐτῷ τῷ οὐ...
by Peter Kirby
Thu Jun 11, 2015 5:18 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: A lengthy note on Hebrews 9.24 (into heaven itself).
Replies: 79
Views: 43491

Re: A lengthy note on Hebrews 9.24 (into heaven itself).

And, in your judgment, Christ was on earth when he offered himself as sacrifice? So he was high priest on earth? Yes he was a high priest at the time of his own sacrifice. Even though Hebrews 8.4 says that, if he were on earth, he could not be a priest? Ben. If it makes you feel any better, Ben, I ...
by Peter Kirby
Thu Jun 11, 2015 5:06 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Historicity of Paul, apostle and letter-writer
Replies: 87
Views: 44790

Re: Historicity of Paul, apostle and letter-writer

You've never heard of literary hoaxes? There are thousands of examples in modern times alone. Lemuel Gulliver, Usbek and Rica (the purported authors of "The Persian Letters"), Diedrich Knickerbocker, Silence Dogood, Ossian, the list is endless. People believed these were real authors. Tha...
by Peter Kirby
Thu Jun 11, 2015 4:55 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Historicity of Paul, apostle and letter-writer
Replies: 87
Views: 44790

Re: Historicity of Paul, apostle and letter-writer

... I am struggling to fit it into his paradigm regarding prior probability. I think the way Carrier frames stuff makes it hard to discern. His off-the-cuff writing, especially about Paul, seems very abstract. The most concrete thing that I think he's written in reply, on that blog-post, seems to b...
by Peter Kirby
Thu Jun 11, 2015 4:44 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Historicity of Paul, apostle and letter-writer
Replies: 87
Views: 44790

Re: Historicity of Paul, apostle and letter-writer

I sort of agree with Carrier. I mean, if you look at all known and suspected forgeries, all are either: 1. Forged in the name of someone important who actually wrote letters. (E.g. the letters of Paul and Seneca; even if Paul isn't real, Seneca was.) 2. Forged in the name of someone important who e...