Search found 18049 matches

by Secret Alias
Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:53 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Reconstructing the Proto-(Papias Based)Text for Adversus Haereses 3
Replies: 17
Views: 7550

Re: Reconstructing the Proto-(Papias Based)Text for Adversus Haereses 3

The citation of Psalm 16 in Acts is interesting I foresaw the Lord always before my face; for He is on my right hand , lest I should be moved: therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also, my flesh shall rest in hope: because Thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt...
by Secret Alias
Wed Jul 05, 2017 7:59 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Reconstructing the Proto-(Papias Based)Text for Adversus Haereses 3
Replies: 17
Views: 7550

Reconstructing the Proto-(Papias Based)Text for Adversus Haereses 3

As a purely intellectual exercise I have wondered about a ur-text to Adversus Haereses 3 related to the tradition of Papias in another thread which looked like this: 1.1.1 WE have learned from none others the plan of our salvation, than from those through whom the Gospel has come down to us, which t...
by Secret Alias
Wed Jul 05, 2017 6:02 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Bauckham On the Three Gospels of Papias
Replies: 8
Views: 4782

Re: Bauckham On the Three Gospels of Papias

What does everyone think is Bauckham's strongest evidence for Papias knowing our gospel of John? I am not quite sure I see a strong argument for this other than his interest in John the elder.
by Secret Alias
Tue Jul 04, 2017 2:16 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.
Replies: 19
Views: 6004

Re: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.

Yes that was a great thread. I have started to isolate Bauckam's arguments for the three gospels of Papias in another thread (until I get distracted). But here is the entire book of Bauckam scanned if anyone wants to avoid gaps in Google Books preview - https://lecturanarrativadelabiblia.files.wordp...
by Secret Alias
Tue Jul 04, 2017 2:12 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Bauckham On the Three Gospels of Papias
Replies: 8
Views: 4782

Bauckham On the Three Gospels of Papias

Bauckham begins by examining what Papias means by 'living voice': In order to understand Papias’s preference for the “living voice” over written sources we must first recognize that it was an ancient topos or commonplace. Loveday Alexander has pointed out the close parallel in the prologue to one of...
by Secret Alias
Tue Jul 04, 2017 12:37 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.
Replies: 19
Views: 6004

Re: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.

I was reading Bauckham's understanding of Papias's testimony and it would very much figure into this tripartite gospel commentary I have proposed - https://books.google.com/books?id=qYfMDgAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=papias+bauckham+mark&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjLqsTgvPDUAhWLh1QKH...
by Secret Alias
Tue Jul 04, 2017 11:58 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.
Replies: 19
Views: 6004

Re: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.

Indeed let's be very honest again. If as everyone thinks Adv Haer 1.1.1 is derived from Papias and as we have suggested now Adv Haer's comparison of Matthew and Mark in 1.9.1 is also from Papias let's look at what is in between: 1.2.1 viva voce isn't as important as the Scriptures to determine the t...
by Secret Alias
Tue Jul 04, 2017 11:28 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.
Replies: 19
Views: 6004

Re: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.

Getting back to the section that Ben took a comprehensive look at. First of all that Origen is the first witness for something brings up the question of Eusebius's involvement in the preservation of material from Origen. It might not be Origen at all but Eusebius reworking Origen in a particularly '...
by Secret Alias
Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:57 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.
Replies: 19
Views: 6004

Re: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.

I don't think that's it Peter. First of all, if the order was chronological the 'orthodox myth' as Trobisch notes, has clues scattered (deliberately) in the writings of Paul whereby Paul left items for Luke to gather together and publish after his death. Mark on the other hand seems to have been pub...
by Secret Alias
Tue Jul 04, 2017 8:35 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.
Replies: 19
Views: 6004

Re: Irenaeus, Origen, and Luke 3.7-9.

On the recapitulation the same strange ordering appears (Matthew, Luke, Mark, John) the argument that the prophets 'knew' the most high god (compare the statement in Book Four and repeated elsewhere among the heretics that "no one knew" the ultimate god: Such, then, are the first principle...