Search found 1380 matches

by Joseph D. L.
Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:13 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?
Replies: 25
Views: 13685

Re: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?

When did the image of a crucified Christ become the familiar sign of Christianity? I think in the first two-three centuries we see Jesus depicted in art as a shepherd, a young boy, but not crucified. Or have I terribly overlooked something obvious? Hey Neil. As far as I'm aware, the cross wasn't ar...
by Joseph D. L.
Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:39 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?
Replies: 25
Views: 13685

Re: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?

Here's something else. The infamous Orpheus amulet, dated to the second-third century ad, shows a man upon a cross with the crescent moon and seven stars over him. The inscription, ORPHEOS BAKKIKOS, meaning Orpheus becomes Bacchus, which is fitting as Orpheus was believed to have introduced the myst...
by Joseph D. L.
Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:37 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?
Replies: 25
Views: 13685

Re: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?

Okay, a lot to unpack here, so I'll address each point in their turn. I think there is ZERO evidence that there was some sort of (pre-Christian) "crucifixion ritual " in the ANE region (and let's throw in Syria, Egypt, N. Africa, and anywhere in Europe), despite what Frazer thought/said. E...
by Joseph D. L.
Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:53 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?
Replies: 25
Views: 13685

Re: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?

I'm not meaning to be quarrelsome. But I think there is a LOT of distance (both in miles/kilometers & worldview) between what goes on in Alexandria and what goes on in Galatia. In Gatatians I do not see so much a royal figure being portrayed as portrayed as crucified as the divine redeemer, whi...
by Joseph D. L.
Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:54 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?
Replies: 25
Views: 13685

Re: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?

I think you may be making too much of this. And I think you're missing the point. The issue raised by Giuseppe as to if there was a ritual involving crucifixion is satisfied by Galatians 3:1, wherein Paul states that before their [the Galatians'] eyes, Christ was portrayed as crucified, which would...
by Joseph D. L.
Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:14 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: The Ebionites
Replies: 22
Views: 10423

Re: The Ebionites

John2 wrote: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:24 pm Joseph D.L.,

Thanks for the response. It looks like we have polar opposite views! :)
Indeed. It's just that I can't see how anyone can read these men and not feel as they've just been hoodwinked. But perhaps your model accounts for certain features that mine lacks.
by Joseph D. L.
Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:08 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?
Replies: 25
Views: 13685

Re: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?

The text Acta Pauli et Antonini was specifically addressing performances done just prior to the Kitos revolt, and that Hadrian had ordered them to cease. I don't know if you're acknowledging this point or not, but I felt like reiterating it for clarity's sake. And if this was just a continuation of ...
by Joseph D. L.
Sun Jan 14, 2018 3:41 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?
Replies: 25
Views: 13685

Re: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?

I would like see evidence of a Jewish crucifixion ritual (more than a Pagan crucifixion ritual), since the myth of the expiatory sacrifice (linked to the crucifixion of Jesus) seems to me something enough Jewish. The Maccabean literature states that Antiochus IV Epiphanes had imposed the worship of...
by Joseph D. L.
Sun Jan 14, 2018 3:20 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?
Replies: 25
Views: 13685

Re: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?

This may or may not be relevant, but the Acta Pauli et Antonini does speak of a mock performance by the Alexandrians satirizing Jewish messianic expectations, wherein which an effigy or actor representing the Jewish king would be paraded around, sustaining abuse both verbal and physical. These perfo...
by Joseph D. L.
Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:21 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?
Replies: 25
Views: 13685

Re: What is the evidence that the crucifixion was an old sacrificial rite?

"O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? It was before your eyes that Jesus Christ was publicly portrayed as crucified."

Tim Claason has proposed that Paul was speaking of a ritual, or performance scene.