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by Ben C. Smith
Mon Oct 17, 2016 5:17 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?
Replies: 225
Views: 103763

Re: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?

If Cephas was a different entity than Peter, and a very important one (at least one of the three main pillars in Jerusalem), we would expect some faked epistle(s) attributed to him and early Christian texts stating Peter & Cephas were different persons. But there is none of that except for the ...
by Ben C. Smith
Sun Oct 16, 2016 4:45 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?
Replies: 225
Views: 103763

Re: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?

Mt seems Byz Byzantine? As in the renamed Eastern Roman Empire begun in the 4th century AD/CE? Sort of. "Byzantine" is the name of manuscript tradition, as is Alexandrian. Well, yes and no; what is meant is the Byzantine text type. As in Eastern, I presume (?) Well, it may have originated...
by Ben C. Smith
Sun Oct 16, 2016 4:27 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?
Replies: 225
Views: 103763

Re: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?

MrMacSon wrote:
spin wrote: Mt seems Byz
Byzantine? As in the renamed Eastern Roman Empire begun in the 4th century AD/CE?
Well, yes and no; what is meant is the Byzantine text type.
by Ben C. Smith
Sun Oct 16, 2016 3:18 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?
Replies: 225
Views: 103763

Re: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?

Secret Alias wrote:Of course the question which can't enter many people's minds is - what gospel is Clement citing?
My guarded words for Justin also apply to Clement: "Justin is clearly referencing either Luke 3.22 or a text/tradition which is intimately connected to Luke 3.22."
by Ben C. Smith
Sun Oct 16, 2016 3:05 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?
Replies: 225
Views: 103763

Re: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?

Who is the earliest of the church fathers to attest "You are My Son, this day have I begotten You" was written in Lk 3:22? It is your turn to answer my question now: who is the earliest of the church fathers to attest to the other (the majority) reading specifically in Luke 3.22? If you w...
by Ben C. Smith
Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:59 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?
Replies: 225
Views: 103763

Re: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?

Another one: Clement of Alexandria, Paedagogus 1.6:

For at the moment of the Lord's baptism there sounded a voice from heaven, as a testimony to the Beloved, You are My beloved Son, today have I begotten You.

by Ben C. Smith
Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:54 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?
Replies: 225
Views: 103763

Re: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?

to Ben, None of these testimonies, however, sets forth distinctly the Savior's exalted birth ; but when the words are addressed to Him, You are My Son, this day have I begotten You, this is spoken to Him by God, with whom all time is today, for there is no evening with God, as I consider, and there...
by Ben C. Smith
Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:47 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?
Replies: 225
Views: 103763

Re: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?

But not "executioner". And the meaning of "guard" or "bodyguard" is late (tough not too late for Mark), if I remember correct. Okay, I understand your question now. But it is easily answered, I think. Bodyguards commonly served as executioners. Try this paragraph from ...
by Ben C. Smith
Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:18 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?
Replies: 225
Views: 103763

Re: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?

to Ben, In your quotes from Justin, Justin was paraphrasing the Synoptic gospels and not necessarily commenting on Lk 3:11. It is not clear where he got "today, I have begotten you". Possibly from faulty memory, influenced by one particular Psalm or 'Hebrews'. It is even less clear for yo...
by Ben C. Smith
Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:15 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?
Replies: 225
Views: 103763

Re: IS THE PROTO-LUKE HYPOTHESIS SOUND?

As I said I disagree with you. My impression is that the best example against your conclusion is the speculator in Mark 6:27. I think this word is completely nonsense, especially for an assumed Latin author. Can you explain what you mean by speculator being "completely nonsense"? I think ...