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by MrMacSon
Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:39 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Carrier on "gnosticism"
Replies: 134
Views: 7740

Re: Carrier on "gnosticism"

And the key point is that Irenaeus was wrong to do that Irenaeus wasn't "wrong" to call them Gnostics, just like he wasn't "wrong" to call them heretics. You missed the immediate qualification - Irenaeus’s use of gnostikoi is said to be somewhat confusing, however, since he sometimes seems to apply...
by MrMacSon
Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:31 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Carrier on "gnosticism"
Replies: 134
Views: 7740

Re: Carrier on "gnosticism"

What Carrier is saying is, ignore Gnostics and their writings and anything said about them Surely that's obvious from his own words? He doesn't just want to remove the category 'Gnostic', he wants to remove these sects relevance by presenting them as later offshoots, presumably with them out the wa...
by MrMacSon
Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:09 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Carrier on "gnosticism"
Replies: 134
Views: 7740

Re: Carrier on "gnosticism"

If you want to get even more technical, Catholicism would be γνωστικός and Catholics would be γνωστικός. I agree that Gnosticism is a term that gets too much exposure and is misunderstood, but for opposite reasons. Every religion is gnostic and it's redundant to to use the word to single out hereti...
by MrMacSon
Tue Sep 01, 2020 2:43 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Carrier on "gnosticism"
Replies: 134
Views: 7740

Re: Carrier on "gnosticism"

I'm not qualified to speak of such a linguistic quagmire, but Carrier is being wholly dishonest if he is suggesting that "gnosticism" was just invented out of nothing by modern scholars when it wasn't. The main thing Carrier is doing is trumpeting the work of others - ... all this is due to “cuttin...
by MrMacSon
Tue Sep 01, 2020 2:02 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Carrier on "gnosticism"
Replies: 134
Views: 7740

Re: Carrier on "gnosticism"

What I fear is that the rejection of gnosticism as category may imply also the rejection of an useful feature of it that was at the origin of the euhemerization of Jesus: hostility against YHWH. I should ask to Carrier why he minimizes that feature . Carrier's not rejecting any feature as far as I ...
by MrMacSon
Tue Sep 01, 2020 1:53 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Carrier on "gnosticism"
Replies: 134
Views: 7740

Re: Carrier on "gnosticism"

to Joseph D.L., Irenaeus's Adversus haereses was originally titled, in English translation obviously, “Exposure and Refutation of Knowledge [Gnosis] Falsely So-Called.” At one point Irenaeus mentions “the sect called gnostikê ”, or “knowledge-supplying,” whose myths he claims had been adapted by Val...
by MrMacSon
Tue Sep 01, 2020 1:06 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Carrier on "gnosticism"
Replies: 134
Views: 7740

Re: Carrier on "gnosticism"

Modern scholars didn't coin the term "gnosticism". afaik, the term was coined in the 17th century by Henry More, variably said to have been either when he applied it to 2nd century CE religious groups who had called themselves gnostikoi ; or in a commentary on the seven letters of the Book of Revel...
by MrMacSon
Sun Aug 30, 2020 5:21 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Significance of the Gospel of Thomas if the Canonical Gospels are late?
Replies: 73
Views: 15845

Re: Significance of the Gospel of Thomas if the Canonical Gospels are late?

... these two [nomina sacra] don't stand for Jesus - without presuming a whole bunch Under Absolute Thomasine priority, IS or IHS would just mean simply that... although it does seem fair to assume that I(H)S came first, Jesus later, and that one came before the other. The nomina sacra coming first...
by MrMacSon
Sun Aug 30, 2020 4:24 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Significance of the Gospel of Thomas if the Canonical Gospels are late?
Replies: 73
Views: 15845

Re: Significance of the Gospel of Thomas if the Canonical Gospels are late?

It seems pretty clear to me that both ΙΣ and ΙΗΣ (to use the Greek forms) are nomina sacra for Ἰησοῦς. Not necessarily. ... both IC and IHC are abbreviations ... Not necessarily. it is just that they are abbreviations for the Greek name we drag through the Latin and transliterate as Jesus in Englis...
by MrMacSon
Thu Aug 27, 2020 11:14 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Significance of the Gospel of Thomas if the Canonical Gospels are late?
Replies: 73
Views: 15845

Re: Significance of the Gospel of Thomas if the Canonical Gospels are late?

If the canonical ( or even just the synoptic gospels ) were finalised late, in conjunction with 'Marcion's Gospel' as proposed by Jason BeDuhn, Markus Vinzent, and Matthias Klinghardt (and perhaps other scholars w.r.t. Luke), might that mean extra-canonical texts such as the Gospel of Thomas could ...