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by davidmartin
Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:31 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation
Replies: 17
Views: 360

Re: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation

Thanks Rakovsky when talking about gnostics its more about defining what it means than actually discussing anything! But the gnostics were split into many groups with different ideas. I also suspect strongly there was a tendency towards a more 'religious' gnostic system over time which then clashed ...
by davidmartin
Sat Apr 17, 2021 5:08 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation
Replies: 17
Views: 360

Re: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation

On reflection I agree with what you're saying here It does appear a bit gnostic in the sense of being 'thrown' into the world What i wanted to suggest was maybe some of the texts in Peter's name that were used by the orthodox were a bit gnostic The Gospel of the Hebrews has some gnostic-like feature...
by davidmartin
Fri Apr 16, 2021 9:15 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Marcion versus Mark: who comes first?
Replies: 79
Views: 4491

Re: Marcion versus Mark: who comes first?

With Mcn, while there is no knowledge at all of a Jesus baptized by John (docet Klinghardt) and accordingly no embarrassment at all for something that was not there, the fact remains that the "baptism of John" is perceived as a rival cult Or it wants John's followers to be perceived as a rival cult...
by davidmartin
Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:22 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: The start of the Jesus story
Replies: 228
Views: 31990

Re: The start of the Jesus story

An observation - Luke is connected to Marcion and he is connected to the Pauline epistles. Luke is where you'd expect to find the similarity. One was inspired by the other makes sense If Marcion was distributing his version of Luke together with the epistles he had the perfect opportunity to harmoni...
by davidmartin
Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:52 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation
Replies: 17
Views: 360

Re: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation

DCH Yes not a gnostic creation seems insistent on oneness of God all over the place, addresses plural language of Genesis question in there somewhere Not much to say about Jesus? That citation of Revelation about the angel calling the birds of the air to come and eat the flesh of men, and other cita...
by davidmartin
Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:01 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation
Replies: 17
Views: 360

Re: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation

Hi Rakovsky interesting comments Well, one things for sure - we know this papyrus is genuine because of how it raises more questions than answers! i'm not sure what led to those selected quotes being associated to the Preaching except as a possible guess at a potential source This part in Blue comes...
by davidmartin
Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:40 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation
Replies: 17
Views: 360

Re: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation

It is quite interesting Ben I guess. Eugenia said that some of the scripture quotes contain unusual readings she did do an amazing job of this Would look forward to what you make of it! Here's the suspected Preaching of Peter references, some are more certain than others It appears the author accept...
by davidmartin
Thu Apr 15, 2021 4:11 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Papyrus 20915 - English Translation
Replies: 17
Views: 360

Papyrus 20915 - English Translation

My one gift to this forum, see the attached translation of this 2nd century Coptic work from German into English Done by a gifted scholar I know Eugenia (PM for contact details) It contains quotes from the Preaching of Peter, many old testament quotes and so on, some gospel quotes The work is rather...
by davidmartin
Wed Apr 14, 2021 1:48 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: The start of the Jesus story
Replies: 228
Views: 31990

Re: The start of the Jesus story

Yeah, i agree generally with that except i think the 'repent to be saved' of Mark is also an addition to the base story cause i think there is a layer underneath the rewrites in the original its getting some revelation of god that saves from guru jesus, like a personal experience of god that's it, t...
by davidmartin
Tue Apr 13, 2021 5:06 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: The start of the Jesus story
Replies: 228
Views: 31990

Re: The start of the Jesus story

The author of gJohn claimed the Comforter was the Holy Ghost and that his disciples could not receive the Holy Ghost unless he went away but he seems to have forgotten his own story and claimed the disciples received the Holy Ghost before he had gone away on the very same day that Jesus supposedly ...